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Transit Tangents
The Podcast where we discuss all things transit. Join us as we dive into transit systems across the US, bring you interviews with experts and advocates, and engage in some fun and exciting challenges along the way.
Transit Tangents
Transit Politics in the Lone Star State
Freedom of mobility isn't just a catchy phrase—it's the foundation of a vision for Texas where citizens aren't bound to a single transportation option. State Representative John Bucy shares his ambitious plans for expanding transportation choices across the Lone Star State, from high-speed rail connecting major cities to defending Austin's Project Connect light rail system.
As one of the legislature's most vocal transit advocates, Bucy has sponsored critical legislation like HB 483 (authorizing public-private partnerships for high-speed rail along I-35), HJR-58 (a constitutional amendment allowing highway funds for other transportation modes), and HB 542 (permitting state highway funds for transit-oriented projects). His advocacy comes from personal experience—splitting time between Austin and Dallas as a child, he imagined faster, more efficient ways to make that journey.
The conversation reveals how transit debates in Texas often transcend the merits of the transportation systems themselves. "It's been less about the train and more about anti-Austin," Bucy explains, highlighting how urban-rural tensions and partisan politics frequently overshadow practical discussions about mobility. Despite these challenges, he's found surprising allies, with four Republicans joining Democrats to advance high-speed rail legislation out of committee—the first pro-transportation bill to gain traction in the Texas legislature in two decades.
Particularly fascinating is Bucy's reframing of transit as a freedom issue, cleverly positioning public transportation in terms that might resonate with conservative Texans who typically value individual choice. "I drive a Jeep," he notes. "This isn't to get rid of trucks and Jeeps...it's to increase freedom of mobility for all Texans."
The most compelling argument might be historical: "In the 80s, Texas was known as the leader in infrastructure," Bucy reflects. "Our roads were the best system across the country, and we have fallen off." For a state that prides itself on exceptionalism, the idea of reclaiming leadership in transportation innovation could be the key to building broader support for transit.
Want to help make this vision a reality? Contact your representatives, especially if they're Republicans, and explain how transit benefits everyone—even those who never plan to use it—by providing more choices and reducing highway congestion.
On this week's episode, I took a short trip to the Texas Capitol to meet with Texas State Representative John Busey. Representative Buusty has become one of the top transit advocates in the state. He's sponsored bills like HB 483, which would authorize the Texas Department of Transportation to form a public-private partnership to build and operate a high-speed rail line along the I-35 corridor. He's also sponsored HJR-58, which would be a constitutional amendment that would allow the Texas highway funds to be used for other purposes. And HB 542, which would change the Texas Transportation Code to allow for state highway funds to be used for transit-oriented projects. Representative Busey has also been a fierce advocate for Project Connect, which is Austin's budding light rail system, and he helped defeat other measures brought to the legislature that would have forced the city to abandon those light rail ambitions. With all of this great work advocating for transit in the state of Texas, I wanted to ask Representative Busey what he saw as the ideal vision of a transit-focused future for Texas.
SPEAKER_03:I think Texans need freedom of mobility. And so that means choice and options and real choices. I think right now we're so bound by our vehicles and airplanes. And I think if we could add uh significantly more infrastructure around trains, whether it be locally within our cities or high-speed rail to connect our cities in such a flat grand state, we would have great success doing that. And then I think about within our communities, how we could focus more on biking and other forms of mobility is important too. So it needs to be a holistic approach. But I do think, and we'll get into the politics of this, we see like a clash between partisan divide. I don't mean this as competition in a way that's to silence one individual or one industry. I drive a I drive a Jeep. I'm it's this isn't to get rid of the fun and joy of being in our trucks and our jeeps or anything like that. For me, it's to increase freedom of mobility for all Texans to make the best decision for them. I grew up traveling between Austin and Dallas as a divorce kid. I'm from Austin. Mom moved to Dallas and split my time and either flying by myself on that road or being on a bus or in a car. I just really had a vision and dream that we could connect that with high-speed rail. And I know at times in our history, there's been a lot of bipartisan support from that, whether it was from you know former Governor Rick Perry looking at trains on that road. I know Governor Greg Abbott has spoken in favor of high-speed rail at times and his his tenure as governor. I think we have to find more political will to go get this done.
SPEAKER_02:There is a key phrase here: freedom of mobility. Now, this is a concept that we have talked about many, many times on the show. More transit choices not only equal more options for those who would otherwise drive their car, but it also provides an opportunity for your neighbors down the road who may not have the means to own a car to fully participate in society. So, about those opponents, I asked Representative Busey about this concept of freedom of mobility and how well it resonates with the communities that he represents.
SPEAKER_03:You know, this came up a lot in in my first two terms in the legislature because before redistricting, I used to represent the city of Leander, which is part of the red line, part of Project, I mean not Project Connect at the time, but proverb uh Cap Metro, and they were the one of the only cities to really opt in to the train. And so there was always this kind of fight between the opposition that wanted to get out saying, well, nobody uses the train. Well, one, that's not true. We know during high peak of rush hour, so in the morning and coming home, the train's at max capacity. So the train is efficient at helping the commuters, which was the purpose of the Leander Connection to help them commute into downtown. But I think the other thing that gets lost, and it was to your point of saying you want the option, you want the freedom. People chose Leander over Liberty Hill or maybe Cedar Park or Round Rock because it had the train. And so it's not that maybe everyone's gonna use it every day, but they want that option in their community. They want that access, and some are gonna use it every day, some are gonna use it on a Saturday to bring their kids downtown in the morning and have a fun day down here and then ride the train back home. Something I've done with my kids because they enjoy the train ride. I've got a three and five-year-old, so that you know these young, young people love it. But I think so, not only is it practical, it's also a benefit to a community. And I think that's why Leander has has shown that benefit and people have chosen to live there instead of somewhere even closer or a little bit further. And and I think when you see the naysayers challenge that, that it's not used, it's a waste. Well, they went to the vote of the people, and the people in that community reaffirm their commitment to staying with the train. And so I think we can just see anecdotally that it's benefiting Leander. And if we could add this to more communities, I think the citizens would would agree that it is a plus to their community.
SPEAKER_02:Being in Texas and fighting for transit can really seem like a foolish endeavor. So I was very curious about what sparked Representative Busey's interest and why he has become such a fierce advocate and dedicated so much time to this cause.
SPEAKER_03:Well, you know, I'm from the city of Austin and I was I was born here. My parents were both capital staffers. I kind of grew up in this world, and so I grew up in a world where I could see government on its good days can benefit the people of this state and this community. And and uh unfortunately, I don't think we have enough good days, but we've had some along my tenure being here. I think about a public education bill that we we passed my freshman year, where 149 people behind it. It was something that really was going to help after 20 years of neglect. And so when we get together and we unify, we do good things. Unfortunately, a lot of time we've gotten together, we've gotten divided in our groups here, and we've attacked local control and we've attacked local communities. And so someone that as an Austinite grew up watching that bill 20 plus years ago fell just by about a point and a half that would have created an infrastructure plan here in Austin of rail, just barely fell.
SPEAKER_02:And the bill he's referring to is a$1.9 billion proposal that happened in 2000. Now that would have started with 14 miles of rail and eventually grown into a full rail coverage of about 52 miles. It was defeated by around 2,000 votes, but it did gain the support of about 49.6 Austinites back in that time. The city could have been a very different place uh had it passed.
SPEAKER_03:Seeing how we've continued to boom and we've continued to have traffic and living only 12 miles from the Capitol, I could sit in traffic for 45 minutes. Uh it's just been a frustrating thing. And so then when Project Connect came along, the idea of being one of the elected officials that was in support, enlisted and campaigning for it and supporting it, um, I was just so excited to see how overwhelming, the overwhelming support from the city of Austin for it and and and the voters for it. And then to have like a representative that only represents, I think, a hundred people of Austin, Ellen Troxclair come out and start attacking it and filing legislation to override an election, uh it was just it was really hard to stomach. The idea that one, yes, you're allowed to disagree with the plan, we had a vote of the people, and you lost. And I we I lose a lot in this society. When we're in a representative democracy, we lose a lot of the time. But then to go try to overturn an election through some state policy, which probably wouldn't even be upheld in the courts, but they know that they just know it will create such a burden that the project will suffer anyways. And so when you see that, we have to stand up and defend our communities. And and the Austin voters wanted this, they continue to want this. They're not naive as to what they were voting for, as the opposition tries to say. They try to act like Austin voters were not intelligent enough to understand what they were voting for. This is what we wanted. And so I think it's it's our responsibility as elected officials to stand up for our local communities when Texas and and and and Republican, far-right Republican leadership is attacking those communities. And it's not always partisan, and I think we'll get into that. But in this case, it's been less about the train and more about anti-Austin. And that's to me is is disgusting, and we have to fight back on that. And so I've been been committed to that. In the 80s, Texas was known as the leader in this country in infrastructure. Our roads were the best system across the country, and we have fallen off. And I don't know why that is. We've gotten so consumed, our leadership has gotten so consumed, it seems, with making policy in response to social media posts and not thinking about the grand vision of a state. At times, Greg Abbott has been great talking about how we are an innovative state and we're gonna bring in business and we're gonna move forward. Well, part of that plan, if we're gonna really be a state of the future to match our space industry that's growing and other infrastructure and technology, we need to have mobility options and we need to be looking forward. And and it's it's crazy to think that high-speed rail is looking forward when it's been done for 20, 30, 40 years in other parts of the world. But Texas needs to do that, and Texas could again be a leader in infrastructure if we would take these bold steps.
SPEAKER_02:I went to a toll road opening many years ago in um uh Tyler, Texas, or around Tyler's, uh, I think it's SH 49 or whatever the road was there. And I I wish I remembered the state rep's name, but they stood in front of the crowd and they, and I've said this a few times on the show, but they stood in front of the crowd and they said uh that people up there uh knew knew what was right, knew how to get things done and and building this road and opening it. But people in Austin, specifically Austin, uh don't know what they're doing. They're trying to take away lanes uh for buses and bikes and and fight your God-given right to a car. Well, yes.
SPEAKER_03:That was the sort of the rhetoric that um You don't have a right to a driver's license in this state, but you have a god given to a car.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. So so I completely understand that that sort of sentiment of sometimes it does just feel like it's really a fight against Austin and some of the more um democratic cities versus uh the actual mode of transportation itself.
SPEAKER_03:And I think when we think about Texas doesn't really support local infrastructure that way. We don't support mobility projects in the cities, and we should. I I don't know why we wouldn't. I mean, 70% of the population lives in these urban cores. It would benefit everyone. The lawmakers from all across the state come here six months, at least a year, and then the governor keeps calling us back for more and more specials. It is a time to make Austin a showcase city and to really expand what we could do as a leader because people come. They come from the world, they come for, you know, our our races and they come for our concerts, and and we're a global destination now. We should be a pinnacle of growth, and Texas continues to fight that and continues to hinder it. And and it's in it's in infrastructure, but it's across the board the attacks on the city of Boston. I mean, they file bill after bill after bill now to attack this city. And I think to your point about Tyler, your Tyler example, and it may have been Representative Brian Hughes, he's now in the Senate, but I know he represents that area, just to guess. And I've done a lot of good work with him over the years on on some issues and fought with him on other issues, but the Austin is the boogeyman. Austin is is a good primary politics boogeyman for for conservatives, especially rural conservatives, that will go back. They love being here. You know, that that's the dirty secret that they don't want their constituents to know. They love when they get to be in Austin because they come from small towns where the Sizzler is the best restaurant in their town. And here they love to enjoy our concerts and our entertainment and our restaurants and and and just our way of life, and they go back and talk bad about it, and then they hope the governor will call another special session so they can get back here and spend more time in the great city of Austin.
SPEAKER_02:And I do have to say, I grew up on Sizzler, so you can't can't knock it too hard.
SPEAKER_03:I I've been to many, many, many a times. I just think there's some you know something nice about the steakhouses that we have to offer here that they they yearn for when they're back home.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I definitely definitely understand that. We're gonna jump right back into this episode in just a second. But first, if you have not liked this video, go ahead and do so. Also leave a comment. We love reading all of them and respond to as many as we can. Uh and be sure that you are subscribed so that you catch every episode as they come out.
SPEAKER_02:Please share this with your friends. And if you don't have time to watch YouTube videos in the future, you can catch us on any of the podcast platforms that are out there. Uh, just be sure to leave us a rating and uh give us a comment. If you've been following the show for a while, it should be no surprise that it's not just Austin and Cap Metro that gets attacked in these legislative committees. We've featured Data, which is the Dallas Area Transit Alliance, on the show a couple of different times to bring to light the fight that was happening over DART funding. There was a push by the city of Plano to defund DART, which is the Dallas Area Rapid Transit Authority, by as much as 25 to 50 percent, which would have had absolutely devastating effects. Thankfully, that bill did not make it out of committee. But I was curious to ask Representative Busey if the opposition really hates transit, or are they voting in a way that they feel like they have to because maybe their constituents are anti-transit.
SPEAKER_03:Again, these are attacks to go back home to a small select few that they hear from social media a lot, kind of like in Austin. I mean, if you just looked at social media, you would think the city of Austin's against Project Connect, but we keep voting for it, we keep supporting it, the the support is there, there's the support to our office to continue to fight it is there, and look at the election results for it. So I I think it's a small group of loud people, can stir up elected officials. Most of us come from seats where we only have to respond to the extremes of our party because that's the way the maps have been drawn. And so we stop thinking about the big picture and the 200,000 constituents that we each serve and and we lose sight. I I think even in an example here in Austin with Project Connect, the the bill author that was trying to overturn it, right, Representative Troxclair, she always made it a talk, a wonky talk about taxing and never about really the project at hand. I think she knows the people want the project. So if her narrative is that, it's gonna be a backlash. But if she can make it some wonky, she didn't agree with the legal path that Austin took, and they're trying to overturn that legal path. Clearly it's legal, otherwise they wouldn't have to try to overturn it. What they're doing is just trying to get around the issue that Austinites want it, but she doesn't. And so this is a personal vendetta, it appears to be.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, we were fortunate. Uh that was one of the bills. I think this may be the second session where Project Connect has really come under fire. Um, and we were able to get out of the session without any um real damage, I think, to Project Connect. The the bill, I don't think it moved out of dignity.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I mean, it was been scary, close calls both times. I uh, you know, two sessions ago, it was a point of order that I called that killed it. And then this time it was working hard with the speaker's office and the back hall and the mayor being here regularly and was just doing lots of coordination to explain to our colleagues about why it would be ridiculous to overturn us at this point. And so, you know, one of the things outside of Representative Chocks there, but the rest of the people I think putting on their thinking hats about what was going on, they understood we it would be absurd to go overturn this project at this point. It's been voted on, millions of dollars have already been invested, we're moving forward. I think what's really now on the table, and and this all did die, so we'll have to see what comes up next session. I'm sure more will come. But what they're really looking at is changing the way that we did the taxing here. Um, it was legally done. We're really the only people that have done it up to that point, and so they want to change that. But they're if they do it in a way that doesn't grandfather us in, I think, you know, one, they know they'd lose in the courts, two, that'd be absurd and it'd be such a waste of tax dollars at that point.
SPEAKER_02:So Project Connect lives for another session, but we'll definitely face more challenges in the future. I feel really comfortable having representatives like John Busy who are fighting for the autonomy of Texas cities, to make these decisions on their own. But what about connecting cities like Austin to San Antonio or even Austin to Dallas? Well, that is where Texas size politics comes in. On the state level, there's also a discussion about projects like high speed rail. Uh, right now there's a couple proposals that have been put out there, some that have a little more weight than others. We had the Texas, the Texas High Speed Rail project that was looking at connecting Dallas to Houston, and uh they had a legislative win where they were declared a public utility. They were able to start um basically using imminent domain to purchase land. This is also at a point where I don't think they had any funds or any real ability to do that. There was discussion about Amtrak stepping in and helping with that project, but now with the current federal administration, that doesn't seem very likely. Um, but you know, at the at the ground level of all this, there's still hindrances within the state that prevent us from really moving forward on high-speed rail. And I think your bill was was really aimed at addressing that.
SPEAKER_03:Well, and it was a simple bill on paper. I mean, it's a half a page, and what we wanted was one to start a conversation, but also we we want to build a high-speed rail to connect what the bill called for was connect Dallas to Austin to San Antonio um in some of our negotiations and get more bipartisan buildup with the the committee substitute, which ultimately got voted out favorably from public transportation. We added a stop in Waco. Um and and and the goal there was Pat Curry was uh becoming a champion of this issue. And we're gonna be working on this in the interim. And you talk about bipartisan support, he's Republican state representative from the Waco area. And so we want to figure out what we can do to grow that bipartisan support. I think some of the hindrances are there's been talks about doing rail projects like this all the way back to the 90s. At that time, you saw major opposition from Southwest Airlines, who I use all the time and love for the air, but the idea that they were stopping competition, I think, has really hurt the state of Texas when it comes to growth and again our goal for freedom of mobility. Sometimes I want to hop on a plane, sometimes I want to hop on a train. Um, and we need to have those options. Sometimes I want to drive my Jeep. And and and and those are the choices I want, and I want for you know all Texans. And so we we've had those fights from kind of the lobby world, high-dollar lobby world, fighting, fighting train projects. I think now we see most of the fight coming from kind of this uh protection of rural life, this idea of right-of-way. And and um, you know, I I think we're talking about a small segment of land that would benefit millions of Texans. And and I I I have some land out in the Big Bend area. I understand and respect property rights, but I also understand and respect the bigger picture of serving an entire state and the community. And, you know, Texas is gonna lead. We need to do these things. And so that's where we see a lot of of a lot of the the fight. And we saw that in the Houston-Dallas project, a lot of imminent domain land rights fighting. And and I I think it's fair. I mean, if it's your family and your land, you're gonna be very concerned. And so that needs to be taken seriously. I think some lessons we can learn if we do move forward with another project is we could do a better job. And and I'm speaking, I guess, uh, about the Houston-Dallas project, we do a better job in communication. We need to talk to the communities and and the neighborhoods that we're talking about going through. We need to be fair with with our prices and options to to buy up the land through imminent domain, make sure that we respect the families that are there and and help understand uh why this is going to be a benefit for the state of Texas. I I think a lot of the complaints I've heard about that project is a lack of transparency and communication. And so I think those need to be lessons learned and we we need to we need to help do our best. I also think one thing we're working on the interim is trying to understand how much of the I-35 corridor is already land that would be available and get a better percentage going into next session with this bill about how much uh property would have to be bought up versus what's already accessible. And and I think on the I-35 corridor, we're gonna find a lot of it's already accessible, and we won't run into some of the challenges that we saw with the Houston-Dallas with all the private ranches and land across the way.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and that's one I don't think we've talked a lot about on the channel, but there uh as you're saying, there has been a proposal as well to go from Austin to um Waco Fort Worth, Dallas to connect the high-speed rail there as well. Like you said, going up the I-35 corridor, which would be great, especially if we were somehow to miraculously connect that with more frequent trains between Austin and San Antonio, which we've interviewed uh Judge Andy Brown about in the past too. The imminent domain fight is such an interesting one in Texas because when we look at the the political will and sort of political power that comes with building a highway, those fights don't seem to be much of an issue. So it's it's almost if we could change the political priority to treat rail just as a highway, which in reality it should be treated a lot more like a road. It seems like that that could help us make um some inroads. So we have legal opposition, strong property rights that lead to many, many issues with imminent domain, and a fear of losing that idyllic character that is rural Texas. So I think it's time to unite Texans on one thing that I know they can get behind. There's something I would just I would love to see it if we could galvanize Republican support by saying, hey, you want to be better than California. That seems to be our main objective in a lot of ways is you want to, as they're holding, say, own the libs or beat the Democrats, whatever. If you really want to show leadership, beat California to high speed rail.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I agree. And you know, they're they're obviously having their project, LA to Vegas, and and they're working on it and they've had challenges. I think we could show how to do it and do it well. And and and the I-35 Corridor or the Houston Dallas Corridor, these are perfect geographic spaces to do this and to test it out and and and build out a high-speed rail. Uh, Texas is the benefit of being big and flat in a lot of these areas, and and you could really build great infrastructure through it. And and I think we should be trying to be the leader in it. And, you know, like I said, I mean, Greg Abbott has talked about high-speed rail in the past in in positive ways. I mean, he obviously is is concerned about you know his his right flank and rural Texas and and and the the land rights, but but I think if we wanted to build out a state that he talks about, then this is going to be such an essential part of that.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, so short of declaring a transit arms race with California, I had to know what else could be done to garner more support from the Republican side of the aisle when it comes to doing projects like high-speed rail in the state of Texas.
SPEAKER_03:Well, I think I think finding more and more bipartisan uh elected officials to work together. So we're in this case, more Republicans work with us. If you look at our our vote, I'm pointing to the committee vote on the bill. I I had four Republicans join all the Democrats on public transportation to vote this out this last time. I think that's a heck of a starting ground. This is the first time in 20 years that we've been talking about pro-transportation bill in Texas legislature as opposed to anti-transportation bill. Um, I know it, you know, it stopped right there, but this is a lot of legislation takes mini sessions. We're what I'm doing right now is uh Representative Pat Curry, who really got on board with this. Um, we're gonna be working in the interim. We're gonna try to find some Senate offices to help and get get by get by chamber support and really hit the ground running next session with this bill and see if we can push it through aggressively. And and and whether that's you know, sometimes the way the political landscape is changing, if it needs to be a Republican, maybe he's the author and then I become the joint author, that doesn't matter to me. What matters to me is that we get this project done for the people of Texas. And and so, you know, our bill also started, like I said, a half page, and it was a public-private partnership, and people are like, what is it gonna cost you? Well, part of that depends on the deal we go out and negotiate. And it gets it tells, you know, the the the department to go out and cut a deal and and find that we're gonna use the interim to really kind of get more in the weeds about what this project would look like so we can bring a lot more information to my colleagues. And and we wanted to start a conversation, and I think we did that. The amount of outreach, I I thought this bill was gonna be something that was hardly talked about. I think we did about 30 or 40 interviews uh after we filed it. People are excited. I got calls from all the way from San Antonio to Dallas from elected officials, not just my state rep colleagues, but uh county commissioners and county judges wanting to get involved and see this happen. Republicans and Democrats, people know that they're people that are connected to their constituents know that they want this. And so we're just gonna take that excitement. And and it wasn't just Pat Curry. I mean, like I said, three other elected officials, former Speaker Tom Craddock, who's the chair of that committee, voted this bill out of committee. I mean, he's the oil man tycoon out of West Texas, and he voted for this bill. And so I think it's a heck of a starting ground that we laid the of a foundation this last session, and we're gonna use this next year to really build support for it and see where we can get.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe that's the trick. The trains have to run on on on diesel.
SPEAKER_03:Well, whatever it takes to get more mobility, we're gonna keep pushing.
SPEAKER_02:So uh, very last thing, what would you say to um constituents, citizens of Texas, if they really want to see this happen, what can they do uh to help get their voice out there?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, talk talk to people and build build the groundswell of support because I think some people are scared. They think about what does this mean for my truck? What does this mean for our highways? What does this mean? We this is about freedom of mobility. This is a benefit to all Texans. And if you don't want to take the train, think how we'll benefit our highway system by having more people on the train and less people on the highway. This is gonna be a benefit across the board. It's gonna allow you to have more choice about how you want to get around this great state. And so go build that support and build that groundswell, especially if you come from a Republican state reps district, our senator's district, and tell them you want to you want to see projects like this in the future. And we can get it done. Texas has thought big and bold before, uh, when it was our highway system, when it's bringing the space industry here, whether it's Firefly, SpaceX, and other companies, when it's bringing Dell computers and building that out. And now we're becoming the tech hub. Well, let's lead in the infrastructure as well. Let's lead in high-speed rail, and we can do it. And and Texans can dream big and then go achieve big by doing this.
SPEAKER_02:It is refreshing to hear this perspective from a member of the Texas legislature. Texas has a long history of rhetoric about preserving and uh defending freedom. But freedom of mobility should be a core tenet of a future Texas, reminding us that true freedom isn't just about where you can drive, but whether everyone has the means to get where they need to go. It's Texans like Representative John Busey that give me just a little more hope that we can all come together and realize that better future and enjoy that true freedom in Texas. If you enjoyed this episode, you can show your support by liking this video, sharing it with your friends, or subscribing to the channel. And if you would like to continue to help us bring more content like this, please feel free to check out our merch store, uh, join our Patreon, or if you'd like to donate, you can do so through Buy Me a Coffee. But with all that being said, thank you so much for watching.
SPEAKER_03:Hey everyone, it's State Representative John Busting. I hope you enjoy the rest of your transit tangent Tuesday.